master pages

[MrPugs]

Just starting with DTP

Have set up a document using Scribus, which look like it will do the job for me
I have used the master page system

Problim: when I move to work on any page bar the first page the system does not work
Have looked up the documentation but can not find away to activate the pages

Regards
Donal

[Christen_Anderson]

when I move to work on any page bar the first page the system does not work
Have looked up the documentation but can not find away to activate the pages

Are you saying that you can only apply the master page to the first page? if so, try Page>Apply Master Page.

HTH,
Christen

[MrPugs]

This is what I am doing

1.Set up adocument with 5 pages
2. Set up first page with 2 text and 2 image frames
3. Convert the first page to a master page
4. Apply the master page to the folllowing 4 pages

All looks good and I have all the pages set up as I set up the first page, but I find that I can only work on the first page. The frames on pages 2-5 do not activate

Many thanks for your patients

Donal

[Meho R.]

Consider a master page as a background or background picture. The point of it is to have similar elements on a certain number of pages, like headers, footers etc. You cannot place an element on a master page and change it on normal pages. It goes against the sole concept of master pages.

So, for example, you can put guides or other objects on a master page which will appear on all pages to which that master page is applied and which will help you have uniform-looking layout, but you'll have to create text frames and image frames on normal pages.

[MrPugs]

Thanks for sorting that out

If I understand the concept correctly: When I apply a master page to other pages a background layout guide is formed for me to work off, but I have to creat text and images frames where there are shown by the backgraound guide

[Meho R.]

Exactly. Static elements which do not change go to master pages, dynamic elements which do change go to normal pages. One exception are page numbers, which should be placed on a master page and which progress automatically...

[gusmarshall]

It is a serious design flaw that you cannot add empty text frames to the master page and edit the contents of those frames on the pages to which you apply that master page. If fixed it could save designers a lot of page set up. The whole point of master pages is to simplify, unify and standardize page layout. This should include the ability to specify the areas of the layout to be used for copy. To compensate for this, Scribus allows you to specify "automatic" text frames on every page in document set up. The problem with this is that you cannot change the text frame layout when switching between master pages ...not that I can find anyway.

[utnik]

hello gusmarshall

you could work with page templates (collected in a separate document). on this pages you may place text- or image frames – whatever you like...
to insert a page from a template go to 'page' → 'import', select the appropriate page from your temlate document, then edit and move whatever you like...

utnik

[Meho R.]

It is a serious design flaw that you cannot add empty text frames to the master page and edit the contents of those frames on the pages to which you apply that master page. If fixed it could save designers a lot of page set up. The whole point of master pages is to simplify, unify and standardize page layout. This should include the ability to specify the areas of the layout to be used for copy. To compensate for this, Scribus allows you to specify "automatic" text frames on every page in document set up. The problem with this is that you cannot change the text frame layout when switching between master pages ...not that I can find anyway.

I disagree. Having dynamic/editable elements on master pages will probably lead to unnecessary complications and create additional problems. Having them InDesign-way (Ctrl+click) means breaking every link with master page and/or style applied, and we'd end up with custom entries on some pages which simply doesn't make much sense. If you want custom entries on some pages, use scrapbook.

[Nermander]

The disadvantage with using the scrapbook is that items in the scrapbook can not (as far as I know) have a fixed position on the page. They end up where you drop them.

I think Scribus needs some kind of "page templates", of course they can be located in scrapbooks, but it is important that they can correspond to a full page, including position relative the page.

Also, items in the scrapbook are (as far as I know) not editable. That's a big drawback. Having to drop it onto a page, edit and then replace the scrapbook entry seems complicated.

[a.l.e]

right click on the scrapbook element and choose "place on page": it will place it at the original place.

having a set of well placed guides will also help you achieve a correct layout.

entries in the scrapbook are not editable, yet. but it would be probably trivial to make them editable (i've filled a feature request... let's see if franz wants to do it)

you can also create a text frame on multiple pages at once and have the automatically linked (see insert > frames; what is missing there is a way to use the current frame as a reference)

while agree that liberating a text frame from a master page looks like a tempting feature, it's also a source errors and i don't think that most people will understand what really happens when they start typing in a frame

(you know: frames could only half separated from the master page: the size and position could be kept, maybe also the border and the background... but what happens when you resize the frame in the master page and now the text does not fit anymore in 3 pages of 200? will you notice it? who knows...)

(or you delete a frame from the master page... and forget that it was detached on 3 pages of 200... pain!)

as already written: i'm 100% for improving how scribus handles such cases... but detaching elements from the master page is imo not the right way to go.

[Nermander]

If I understand right (I ahve only seen it mentioned in some tutorial), InDesign keps track of "how much" the frame has been detached from the template. If you only fill in text, the frame will change position and size of changed in the template. If you also move the frame it will no longer med moved if it is moved in the template, but will possibly change size.

I really think Master pages should be renamed, Page Backgrounds sounds more like what it is.

[a.l.e]

from teh wikipedia

"""Master pages are templates used to automatically copy or link elements and graphic design styles to some or all the pages of a multipage document. Linked elements can be modified without having to change each instance of an element on pages that use the same element. Master pages can also be used to apply graphic design styles to automatic page numbering."""

... seems to match how master pages work in scribus (even if the wording is a bit strange).

is it because the desktop publishing page has a big shiny scribus screenshot in it? who knows?

however: technically it is possible to unlink the content or the formatting...
not an easy task, but it isn't black magic, either. and it will mostly work correctly. but it's imo hard to have get it to work the way the user wants (which is in this case will often be different that what the user is telling the computer to do...).

i'm a fan of the "one tool one task" concept... and i have the feeling that here people want to fit everything in the master pages concept... but there are scrapbook elements, symbols, variable fields, ...

ciao
a.l.e