Author Topic: Can master page items be made local?  (Read 5669 times)

dezcat

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Can master page items be made local?
« on: March 25, 2012, 06:04:15 am »
getting familiar with Scribus' Master pages here..I see nothing in the manual, nor nothing that I can do to "release" items which are on the master page to be editable on the local page to which it is applied.

Is there a way to do so, or are Master Pages strictly for elements which will appear unchanged on their "slave" pages?

thank you!

dcar
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Meho R.

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Re: Can master page items be made local?
« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2012, 03:52:54 pm »
We discussed this a couple of times before, so you might want to start with this thread. In a nutshell, consider master page a "background image" which will appear on normal pages. So, the answer to your question is "no"; elements placed on a master page can be changed on that master page only, never on normal page.

Although many will not agree with me, I personally consider the ability to "unlock" some elements from master pages when working on normal pages (e.g. in Adobe InDesign) a bug which might seriously break consistency throughout the document. Instead of that, use Scarpbook in Scribus for precise placing of elements on normal pages.

dezcat

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Re: Can master page items be made local?
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2012, 01:49:27 am »
Meho R;

Thank you for that link....

I agree with those who feel it is a serious problem that Master Page elements can't be modified locally.

You might think it could lead to complications, but InDesign handles this very nicely. You can make Master Page items editable locally, yet they still retain Master Page function.

For example, you can "localize" a text box to edit the contents, but if you move or change other attributes of that box on the Master, the slave instances reflect that, yet retaining edits made locally.

dcat
« Last Edit: March 26, 2012, 01:53:48 am by dezcat »
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Meho R.

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Re: Can master page items be made local?
« Reply #3 on: March 26, 2012, 02:18:52 am »

[...]

You might think it could lead to complications, but InDesign handles this very nicely. You can make Master Page items editable locally, yet they still retain Master Page function.

For example, you can "localize" a text box to edit the contents, but if you move or change other attributes of that box on the Master, the slave instances reflect that, yet retaining edits made locally.

dcat

Well, that is another story. Last time I used InDesign (I think it was CS), changing any of elements from a master page locally meant breaking any link with its parent, so locally edited element won't respond to any further changes on master pages. But if the link isn't broken anymore, then it's certainly a nice feature to have.

dezcat

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Re: Can master page items be made local?
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2012, 02:35:54 am »
Well, that is another story. Last time I used InDesign (I think it was CS), changing any of elements from a master page locally meant breaking any link with its parent, so locally edited element won't respond to any further changes on master pages. But if the link isn't broken anymore, then it's certainly a nice feature to have.

I think I remember that in the earlier versions of InDesign and I agree that that would be an extremely un-helpful situation to be in...dunno when, but they seem to have matured InDesign up from that..at least in CS4..

Until/unless the Scribus developers can do that, I can deal with Master Pages as static backgrounds..


So, if I wanted my text to be local, then, I set up my textboxes how I want, then apply my master page to that?

thank you,

dcat
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Meho R.

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Re: Can master page items be made local?
« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2012, 02:56:08 pm »
Quote
So, if I wanted my text to be local, then, I set up my textboxes how I want, then apply my master page to that?

Yes, or apply master page first, then set up local text frames, which ever you find more convenient. Also, you can use a placeholder which you'll place on a master page, be it an empty text frame or, even better, guides, which will help you position a local text frame correctly.

Another solution is to create a text frame anywhere in the document (master page or normal page, doesn't matter), place it where you want it to appear on any page, then right click on it > Send to Scrapbook. This way, you can reuse it anywhere in the document and position it on a page exactly where it was created originally (Windows > Scapbook, then right click on the text frame in Scrapbook > Place on Page).
« Last Edit: March 26, 2012, 08:27:47 pm by Meho R. »

dezcat

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Re: Can master page items be made local?
« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2012, 07:41:56 pm »
Quote
So, if I wanted my text to be local, then, I set up my textboxes how I want, then apply my master page to that?
Quote

Yes, or apply master page first, then set up local text frames, which ever you find more convenient. Also, you can use a placeholder which you'll place on a master page, be it an empty text frame or, even better, guides, which will help you position a local text frame correctly.

Another solution is to create a text frame anywhere in the document (master page or normal page, doesn't matter), place it where you want it to appear on any page, then right click on it > Send to Scrapbook. This way, you can reuse it anywhere in the document and position it on a page exactly where it was created originally (Windows > Scapbook, then right click on the text frame in Scrapbook > Place on Page).

OK..that is darned handy-sounding stuff there!  Now, due to how I began using Scribus on this Project, I designed my page on a local, non-master page, then used "Convert to Master Page" to make a master of those elements I want to have on every page using that Master.

Is this a valid, sound method for making a Master Page?

Thank you!

dcat
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Meho R.

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Re: Can master page items be made local?
« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2012, 08:34:29 pm »
Yes, you can convert a normal page to a master page, I don't think that should be an issue (if someone knows a reason why this might lead to problems, please correct me). Just note that the newly created master page doesn't get applied to the original page, you'll have to do that manually.

Rueda

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Re: Can master page items be made local?
« Reply #8 on: April 26, 2012, 05:36:44 pm »
Hello everybody, I'm new in the community.

First: sorry for my english, I am from Spain.

I found the same problem with the  master pages. My opinion is that there is a little confusion about the way a master page it's supposed to work.
The master page shouldn't be a background. You place objects in a master page because you need to arrange an structure to apply to the pages of your project, and then work with those objects, like adding text and images. This is the logic way to work.

Considering master pages to work as a background it's wrong, is it going to be fixed?

Meho R.

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Re: Can master page items be made local?
« Reply #9 on: April 27, 2012, 04:53:07 pm »
Well, for now, Scribus provides master pages as background templates, with static elements only (except for page numbers). For elements that need to be modified in any way on normal page, Scribus provides Scrapbook as a storage for those elements. You might find this workflow illogical, but some of us find it perfectly normal ;)

For more infos regarding devs plans regarding master pages, I recommend to ask at Scribus mailing list, since devs do not monitor this forum closely (maybe a.l.e would respond, but still the mailing list is way to go).

covex

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Re: Can master page items be made local?
« Reply #10 on: June 08, 2012, 09:11:11 pm »
I was also surprised the master page is really not a master page, but a background. My idea of master page was, it is a formating "template" how the page should look like. The name is really missleading.

Meho R.

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Re: Can master page items be made local?
« Reply #11 on: June 08, 2012, 11:20:22 pm »
I was also surprised the master page is really not a master page, but a background. My idea of master page was, it is a formating "template" how the page should look like. The name is really missleading.

It might be misleading if you came to Scribus with a vision of a master page brought from some other apps like InDesign; Scribus has nothing to do with those apps and it has its own concept of a master page: a "background" containing only static objects (that is, objects which cannot be edited/unlocked on normal "slave" pages). This might change in future, but for now it is what it is.

fieldmouse

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Re: Can master page items be made local?
« Reply #12 on: July 22, 2012, 09:34:19 am »
hi all,

i have the same issue here, and was disappointed to learn through my own explorations that meho r's view is correct.

it seems the me the central issue is about batch editing page layout. for example, the ability to set up many, but not all, of a project's pages to have identically positioned text frames which also be able to have their properties (e.g. x, y position, height and width) tweaked all together, particularly after text has been imported. as far as i can tell, one can only set up a page with a frame then copy it. but if one has set up the fame a little incorrectly, then one has to start over again, unable to tweak all pages/text frames in unison. for the laying out of booklets it is very handy to be able to alter the text frame boundaries of multiple pages with the text in place.

am i right in believing that this is not possible? i'm a complete novice, so happy to be told otherwise.

i don't think it is so much a case of wanting to be able to do what indesign could do, but of finding a very handy feature absent, especially for working with longer projects. it is fine if it isn't the master page feature is scribus isn't designed to fulfil this role, but it is still a feature that would greatly improve the programme.

a.l.e

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Re: Can master page items be made local?
« Reply #13 on: July 22, 2012, 09:48:44 am »
we are trying to make this available for the next version.

but it will be in the form of frame styles, not of editable master page elements. and field variables.

with the current stable version, this is not possible yet.

 

palmate