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Author Topic: Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?  (Read 18269 times)

mayfairprint

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Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?
« on: September 09, 2011, 05:42:16 am »
I recently began working for a newspaper designing the ads and formatting the paper it's self. When I submitted my first issue, the press said it couldn't be printed as my blacks were "4 Color Black' as opposed to 100% K Black. As I understand it, the black ink gets it's own plate so it's not laying down 4 colors on a single spot and expecting perfect registration on tiny fonts. Makes perfect sense to me.

This is strange to me as I've been designing for various media professionally for well over a decade now, and have not once run into this problem. I believe I've found a way to convert the blacks after the fact via sending the .pdf over to my Windows machine, opening them in Acrobat and converting them with PitStop Pro plug-in, but that seems too round-about.

Now, this paper is one of those weekly things that comes in your mailbox with like 1000 business ads in it, so i usually design it in GIMP. I'm more comfortable designing in it, and it's always suited my needs, but this time it has not.

My question is, if I design something in GIMP, can I export it in some format (.ps, .tif, etc), open that in Scribus and have Scribus convert it to 100% Black and not 4 Color blacks? Keep in mind, there's many color pages, so I need colors in tact, but I also need a black plate of it's own. Any ideas? It sure would be a life saver

II try to do all my work with F/OSS software (it's even on my business card!), so that's the route I'd like to go if at all possible.

Any help on this would be greatly, greatly appreciated.

Should it matter, I'm using the Linux version on Ubuntu 10.4

Thank y'all!

Nermander

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Re: Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2011, 08:43:08 am »
Scribus can handle both RGB and CMYK colors. If I recall correct the default color called Black is an RGB color. I think the CMYK black is called Grey0 or something like that.

You can see on the icon for the color if it is RGB or CMYK. RGB colors have a "3 band" icon, whereas the CMYK colors have a "4 squares" icon.

You can of course define your own colors or use other color sets. When you have no document open you can go to the settings and chose the default color set.

Wena

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Re: Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2011, 02:50:33 pm »
mayfairprint I think that the problem you had was with a newspaper that was using a digital mode. The would therefore need your work in CMYK colors. The next book I am working on all it's content is in black and semitones, so  the artwork I do for it needs to be CMYK.

Although I have not used this falsity to date, Scribus has the ability to produce CMYK, it is one of the reasons I am using it.

Now I also use Gimp 2.6 but it dose not have that facility. It seems very reasonable that  you can put your art work into  Scribus and export it in the way that you need. Your other problem may be that they need it in a specific PDF form? Ask the paper what they need in the way of a format.

The thread on the subject of CMYK there is a link to this matter that might help you.

http://blog.tsoots.fi/2009/02/preparing-document-for-printer-cmyk-pdf.html


Wena
« Last Edit: September 09, 2011, 02:58:41 pm by Wena »

mayfairprint

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Re: Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2011, 06:11:39 pm »
Now if I load a file created in GIMP into Scribus, will it convert the blacks to 100% K, or do they need to be redone entirely?

WalksIn2Trees

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Re: Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2011, 08:04:05 pm »
wait the exact issue is?
is this printing ALL black and you're giving them a color image, so they want a greyscale?
Scribus can convert this non-destructively with it's image effects

or are there only parts of an image that should be all black such as text?
in this case what happens is, it's being halftoned and so all 4 colors are being printed in shades, which looks horrible... this must be the first quality printer you've come across so far haha... scribus CAN'T do this

you need to edit the image file:
select/mask those areas that need all black and fill with 100% black... you can check it by switching from color channel to color channel while selected/masked and clear the selected/masked area in the unwanted channels

Ideally though, it's always better to give them editable text not embedded in the image if you can help it....it will look better and will look just as good at any size, and you won't run into an issue like this


mayfairprint

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Re: Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?
« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2011, 02:57:51 am »
Is there an easy way to select/mask all of the black (text or otherwise) and do a fill? Ideally on the entire document, but even page by page would do. The way the printer is making it sound, they need to replace every single little thing one at a time, and I don't think that can be the case at all.

I don't know the exact method or tools to go about it, but it seems there should be a way to load the file, select by color (the four color black) and do a fill with 100% K Black. Like I can't believe there would be no way for this to happen somewhat easily. Any ideas?

Wena

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Re: Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?
« Reply #6 on: September 15, 2011, 01:09:39 pm »
mayfairprint, have you asked the newspaper what they need, then if you cant find the answer to that let this forum know.

Wena

mayfairprint

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Re: Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2011, 08:48:28 pm »
Ok, so it looks like I'm going to need to rebuild this entire thing in scribus.

Can someone let me know the proper document settings to create a PDF in CMYK with 100% K black text?

I'm pretty new to scribus, especially in regards to building an entire pdf in it, so if someone would be kind enough to walk me through setting it up to create and export in cmyk it would be greatly appreciated.

utnik

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Re: Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?
« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2011, 12:54:06 am »
in the standard color pallet you will find:
  • black (0,0,0,100)
  • cool black (60,0,0,100)
  • warm black (0,60,30,100)
  • rich black (60,40,40,100)
the default for text is black (0,0,0,100) – at least in scribus 1.4.0rc5 – so everything should be ok…

utnik

mayfairprint

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Re: Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?
« Reply #9 on: September 22, 2011, 03:29:33 am »
So I don't have to worry about the black settings on the text? Excellent. one less thing I need to worry about.

Are there any settings i should set in regards to first creating the document to ensure it's CMYK?

And how should I export it to make sure it remains CMYK?

utnik

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Re: Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?
« Reply #10 on: September 22, 2011, 12:59:07 pm »
you set the options in 'file' → 'document properties' → 'pdf-export' → 'colors' to 'printer' and select the right cmyk profile.
if you do artwork direct in scribus, you can use cmyk colors (don't use the blsck called 'registration' – it's 100,100,100,100 and won't amuse the printer…)
the pictures you should usually insert rgb and convert when generating the pdf.
this is not working for pdf/x-3 because the x-3 specifications allow rgb images with embedded profiles and scribus will not convert them to cmyk.
if your printer requires pdf/x-3 with cmyk-pictures, you have to convert in an image processing program – unfortunately gimp needs a plug-in for this job. (http://cue.yellowmagic.info/softwares/separate-plus/)

utnik

Wena

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Re: Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?
« Reply #11 on: September 24, 2011, 01:37:01 pm »
Surly we are discussing CMYK and I have been attempting in another threat on this matter, please, someone tell me/us just how to convert a graphic into a CMYK within Scribus 1.4.

Wena 

utnik

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Re: Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?
« Reply #12 on: September 24, 2011, 09:52:06 pm »
hi wena

all your artwork will be converted when you export the final pdf (with option 'printer' and the correct icc profile selected).
as you can read in my last post, this will not work for pdf/x-3 (but your target is a pdf/-1a, as i remember – so everything should work well…)

utnik

mayfairprint

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Re: Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?
« Reply #13 on: September 29, 2011, 02:54:24 am »
Sooooooooooooooooooo

I've managed to create a .pdf with 100% K black text. Yay!

BUT, this leaves me only half-fixed. This very well could be impossible in Scribus, so please let me know if that's the case

When exporting the pdf (for printer, cmyk), all my images indeed change to CMYK, but all the black isn't 100K black, it's cmyk black.

The most frustrating thing is, when i go to print preview, I can separate the colors just fine, with all the blacks being the loveliest of 100K blacks you've ever seen- images and text. But the final PDF doesn't separate that way. All the blacks (except the text) are cmyk black on the exported pdf.

Am I missing something, or is it that the print preview is just smarter than the export?

a.l.e

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Re: Converting 4 Color Black to 100% K Black?
« Reply #14 on: September 29, 2011, 10:16:11 am »
myfairprint, please share a test .sla and the resulting pdf for testing

ciao
a.l.e

 

palmate