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Scribus => Beginner Talk => Topic started by: soso74 on November 04, 2012, 07:39:57 pm

Title: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: soso74 on November 04, 2012, 07:39:57 pm
Hello,

I get into troubles... I created a document with page size 441x666pt and I defined some margins etc. but when I export in into PDF and I read it with Adobe Reader and I check the properties of the document, the size is not the one I defined.. it's bigger like if the margins were added outside de document instead of inside..

Did I do something wrong?

Thanks
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: GarryP on November 08, 2012, 03:01:06 pm
I tried doing the same with a blank document at 441pt x 666pt in Scribus 1.4.1 on OS X and it exported to PDF just fine.

Acrobat Reader 9.5.2 shows the document size to be 6.12in x 9.25in (which translates to 440.64pt x 666pt) and "Get Info" on the file itself shows the document to have the expected dimensions.

Did you add bleeds to the document when it was created (either specifically or by default, check your preferences)? That would increase the size of the page.
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: soso74 on November 18, 2012, 09:06:12 am
Yes I have bleeds in my document. Then does that mean that if I want to use bleeds then I have to calculate the size of the page minus these bleeds size? e.g. if the final size of the document is 661pt width and the bleeds are 10pt then I should say that the width of the document is 661-10 = 651pt?

Thanks a lot
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: soso74 on November 18, 2012, 09:30:52 am
There is something really strange.. Even if I change the size of my document in scribus to 100pt width.. and I export it into PDF it remains 521pt width when I check the properties of the PDF file... Something is wrong but I do not understand what??
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: soso74 on November 18, 2012, 09:50:19 am
I forgot to check the option "apply to all pages"...

If I want to get the final size 441x666pt in the properties of the final pdf size I had to set the size of the document in scribus to 361x586pt... It's strange because I have:

* Margins: Interior: 45pt, Exterior/Top/Bottom: 18pt
* Bleeds: 9pt to all

So I do not understand why I should choose these 361pt for width and 586pt for height of the document?

Thanks for your help..
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: Nermander on November 18, 2012, 10:44:37 am
Scribus will add trim/bleed marks outside the bleed area, so if those marks are included the PDF size will be bigger than the page size.

The whole point with bleed is to add additiona space outside the page, the printing process should use the trim box to decide what part of the page is "the content" and it should not matter whether there is space outside.
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: soso74 on November 18, 2012, 02:02:26 pm
Thanks for your help.

But then.. if I have a page size of 361pt width and I have bleed of 9pt and margins of 18pt and interior margin of 45pt.. then the final size of my pdf should be: 361 + 9*2 + 18*2 + 45 = 460pt although the final size of the pdf (checking inside the properties of the pdf) is 441pt.. so why?

Thanks again
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: utnik on November 18, 2012, 03:32:08 pm
hi soso74

you mix up a couple of things:
only the bleeds (and additional infos like cut marks or registration marks…) add up – the final pdf should be the page size + the bleeds + ~2pt surrounding (if you don't print any additional marks…)

if you have access to acrobat pro you can check all the areas of the final pdf.
utnik
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: soso74 on November 20, 2012, 09:03:51 pm
Thanks a lot for your help.

But then the size of the pdf (in my example) would be 361+2*9 (9 is the size of the bleed I set in scribus) but then even with 2pt more the size of the pdf should be around 383 and not 441... So I do not understand why I get this? I am confused sorry..

Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: utnik on November 21, 2012, 12:52:57 am
hi soso47

show me a sample .sla with its final .pdf file – then i can try to bring some light in…

utnik
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: Nermander on November 21, 2012, 10:02:16 am
I just tested here. I created a sample document with the settings mentioned above:

Size 361x586pt
Left margin 45pt
Top margin 18pt
Right margin 18pt
Bottom margin 18pt
Bleeds 9pt

Exported first to PDF with no bleeds and no marks. Acrobat says 361x586 pt size.

Then export to PDF with no bleed but crop marks. Acrobat says 401x626 pt size.

Export to PDF with bleed but no marks. Acrobat says 379x604 pt size.

Export to PDF with both bleed and crop marks. Acrobat says 419x644 pt size.

Files attached.


I think the problem here is that Scribus allows no control of the size of the region used for crop/trim marks. The intention is probably that the RIP should take care of removing excess "margins" when the job is imposed. The best solution is probably to let Scribus make the PDF as large as needed, and then use some other tool to crop the PDF to the desired size.
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: utnik on November 21, 2012, 08:14:12 pm
hi soso74
hi nermander

for me everything looks as expected. if you take a look at the different frames in acrobat ('print production' – 'crop pages'), you'll see, that the final page is 361x586pt for every file.
bleeds and crop marks need some space – so the full pdf size needs to be bigger!

i can't find a problem here…

utnik
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: Nermander on November 22, 2012, 11:13:04 am
The "problem" is that soso74 wants to have control of the size of the region used for the "marks", but Scribus does not allow that control. Now Scribus adds "to much space". Scribus only allows changing the bleed area, not the "marks" area.

So, as I said, the best solution is most likely to crop the document to the desired size in an external application. Or, if the PDF "boxes" don't have to be correct, use the "old" 1.3.3.x way for bleed (create the page size the same as the sheet and use guides and margins to place the content within the correct area).

http://wiki.scribus.net/canvas/Bleed_workarounds
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: soso74 on November 22, 2012, 09:02:18 pm
Thanks a lot for your time and help..

I am trying to get this final size of the pdf because I would like to print my document with blurb... and they say to verify with Adobe Reader if the final size is correct...
http://www.blurb.fr/pdf-to-book-previewing-guides

Maybe I confused how to check this final size of the pdf then?
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: utnik on November 22, 2012, 10:51:17 pm
hi soso74

on the linked blurb info page they recommend to check the final dimensions. but the dimensiones listed in the properties screenshot are those of the full pdf file. for the final page size (after cutting) you need acrobat pro (or you trust scribus…)

utnik
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: soso74 on November 23, 2012, 09:48:34 am
Ah oki. I do not have Acrobat Pro unfortunately:-(

So just to be sure, in scribus when setting the size of the document content, I should give the size of the document minus the bleeds? Or the size of the document at the end?

For example I want a final document of size 441x666pt should I give 441 and 666 for the size of the document or 441-18 and 666-18 for the size of the document if the bleeds at 9pt large?

Thanks a lot again!
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: utnik on November 23, 2012, 10:11:46 am
hi soso74

you have to insert the final size of the document (441x666pt) scribus will add the surrounding bleeds (if you define any…)
make sure you check the 'use document bleeds' box when you export the .pdf file – otherwhise scribus will crop the file to the final size.

utnik
Title: Re: Size and exportation to pdf
Post by: soso74 on November 23, 2012, 11:04:13 am
Ok thank you very much! I will try this then.