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Scribus => Beginner Talk => Topic started by: remadepreacher on April 12, 2018, 01:51:57 am

Title: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: remadepreacher on April 12, 2018, 01:51:57 am
I have three issues to bring up in this subject:
1. I've created new documents with 30 pages and linked automatic text boxes. If I paste in plain text in the first box and move the mouse over the text you see the cursor. But if I use get text for input from an .odt the cursor is now a hand and I can do nothing with the text except in Story editor. I've tried checking different options with paragraph styles and it makes no difference. As I'm needing to use advanced text options in properties, this won't do. I'm using Scribus 1.4.6 in OS X High Sierra. I also opened it in 1.5.3 and the trouble remains the same.
2. The second document I tried this on will not get text properly. This happened with the first one as well, until I removed a picture and footnotes. But I've removed those from this one and it still jumbles up nearly 7 pages of text on to the the bottom of the first and the second page. Both documents were created on OO Writer and have the same content and formatting.
3. How do you get text from an .odt in 1.5.3?
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: remadepreacher on April 12, 2018, 03:53:44 am
I can now answer #3, Get Text is in Content. Also the problems with #2 are not happening in 1.5.3. Unfortunately, the result is the same as in #1. A cursor shows over the text until you click it, then it becomes a hand.

Also, now there is a new question,
4. Where is text in properties in 1.5.3?
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: utnik on April 12, 2018, 07:05:59 am
…the cursor is now a hand and I can do nothing with the text except in Story editor.

double clicking will bring you from frame editing to content editing mode.
Quote
Where is text in properties in 1.5.3?

there is a new palette for 'text properties'. (f3)

utnik
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: GarryP on April 12, 2018, 11:45:25 am
First I would recommend not to use automatic text frames. That's not everyone's opinion, but I've seen people get into weird trouble when using them.
Even if you have hundreds of pages I would still recommend manually creating the frames, as the time spent creating the frames will be far less than the time needed to get out of trouble if something goes wrong.

Generally, the mouse pointer changes from a top-left-to-bottom-right arrow to a hand when it moves onto an object - text frame, rectangle, whatever - that is selected. The contents of the object should make no difference to this. It's just Scribus saying "the pointer is over something that is active".

Try creating a new document and adding the text frames manually - using Snap to Guides (which also works with the margins) - as see how you get on.
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: remadepreacher on April 12, 2018, 03:24:44 pm
Thanks for responding.
I have double clicked many times, no difference. I also created the first of these without automatic text frames — once again the result are the same. This is the first I've heard creating automatic text boxes may not be the best. It doesn't take long, I'll keep that in mind.
I gather text does not come up in properties in 1.5.3 until you click on the text. Thus, I can't see it.
Update, today I pasted plain text in 1.5.3 using Story Editor, it also can not be effected from the text box.
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: utnik on April 12, 2018, 06:57:03 pm
hi remadepreacher
This is the first I've heard creating automatic text boxes may not be the best.

well, i use them with almost every text heavy project. if you're careful, it's a strong and fast way to deal with text.
Quote
I gather text does not come up in properties in 1.5.3 until you click on the text.

see my post above!
Quote
…today I pasted plain text in 1.5.3 using Story Editor, it also can not be effected from the text box.

could you upload a sample file?

utnik
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: RodneyLee on April 12, 2018, 10:51:02 pm
I find I have to switch to the pointer/select tool then double click on the text box to edit in the box
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: remadepreacher on April 13, 2018, 02:52:28 am
Ok, I just checked the font of the doc from Text Edit I was imputing. Some of it was a font called menlo — which is strange because Helvetica new is default in Text Edit. I remember Scribus asking if it was ok to substitute for Helvitica Neu. I now changed the to Georgia (my choice for most of the chapters). I still had to paste into Story Editor. I can double click on the text and the cursor work now (btw, I was double clicking before). I can erase that, double click and type new text in. I tried downloading a chapter in get text, it works perfectly, as well. I can even drag and drop in. I went to new document from template in 1.4.6. I couldn't double click on a new text box in it until I pasted the Georgia text into Story Editor again. I'm attaching a blank doc from that Template.
I still don't understand how this behavior migrated over to 1.5.3 when I created a new document at the beginning. I just did this again and it is fine.

Main problem left — I still do not see text in the options in properties in 1.5.3 after clicking or highlighting on the text.

This is a side issue but I'm still a bit concerned about the text. I should explain what all I had to go through to get it. I began with MS Word and had huge amount of corruption and weird behavior. Eventually, I dumped Word. To purify the text, I took a screen shot of each page and used the ocr in Adobe Acrobat to get the text. Some words did not look right, so I retyped them either ahead or behind in the middle of another word and cut the offender. Then I put this text in an online compare document program, Diffnow.com. and compared the text with the original. I corrected the new text there and copy and pasted into Text Edit.
I think that some new corruption may remain in the text from this process as some pretty ordinary words are not being recognized by spell check. Now that the program is working all right with it, should I trust it? Or will it create trouble down the road? I tried attaching a sample .odt but this program will not accept that so converted to .doc


Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: utnik on April 13, 2018, 05:24:21 am
hi remadepreacher

…I still do not see text in the options in properties in 1.5.3 after clicking or highlighting on the text.

i may tell you the same thing once more: in scribus 1.5.x the text properties are collected in a separate window!!! – you open it by pressing the 'f3' key! – there's no help if you don't read it!

Quote
I should explain what all I had to go through to get it. I began with MS Word and had huge amount of corruption and weird behavior. Eventually, I dumped Word. To purify the text, I took a screen shot of each page and used the ocr in Adobe Acrobat to get the text. Some words did not look right, so I retyped them either ahead or behind in the middle of another word and cut the offender. Then I put this text in an online compare document program, Diffnow.com. and compared the text with the original. I corrected the new text there and copy and pasted into Text Edit.
I think that some new corruption may remain in the text from this process as some pretty ordinary words are not being recognized by spell check. Now that the program is working all right with it, should I trust it? Or will it create trouble down the road? I tried attaching a sample .odt but this program will not accept that so converted to .doc

i don't know why you're doing all this weird stuff. but i can load your text in text frames in scribus 1.4.6 and 1.5.3 either with 'get text'  (well, i saved the file in .odt format before…) or by pasting it into the 'story editor' (which i almost never use in my real work…)
everything works as expected – the text is editable direct in the text frame.

utnik
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: remadepreacher on April 13, 2018, 07:57:57 am
Utnik, thanks for the persistence but on a mac, F3 only brings up an overview of everything on the desktop.
Anyone know the shortcut to bring up text options for a mac in 1.5.3?
(Note, I found it in a video that compares 1.4 and 1.5. It is available under Windows after you close the regular properties box and have the curser in the text box).
 
Also, I found a trick to turn to curser in 1.5.3, hit the "e" key. You may have to do this periodically.

Ok, I can work more than I could, loading is now do-able. But it turns out that when I try to change styles on certain parts of the text, I still have another #11 crash, both in 1.4.6 and 1.5.3. So evidently there are still problems with the styles or fonts brought over with the .odt.
 
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: a.l.e on April 13, 2018, 10:41:15 am
please google about mac and function / media keys.

if you have not switched the default behavior for the function keys, you will have to press fn + F3 to get the text properties.
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: RodneyLee on April 13, 2018, 04:52:31 pm
Ok, I can work more than I could, loading is now do-able. But it turns out that when I try to change styles on certain parts of the text, I still have another #11 crash, both in 1.4.6 and 1.5.3. So evidently there are still problems with the styles or fonts brought over with the .odt.

I had that problem for a bit in 1.5.3 in linux, eventually my file stopped loading, I think tried 1.5.2 and then 1.5.4 which loaded up the file, I think delete all styles (and all other steeing that effect text,TAB ETC), save and reloaded into 1.5.3 Reset TABS and nothing has crashed since.

best guess its something is off with imported text or old code embedded in text, 1.5.3 has been super stable for me
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: remadepreacher on April 14, 2018, 02:23:10 am
Thanks, Rodney Lee and a.l.e. I'll try changing the fn-f3 setting. I removed all styles and rebuilt them with no text and then saved as as template. Oddly this is not in my templates. There are a .png and XML doc with that name on the computer.

Should someone want to examine the text causing the #11 crashes, I'm attaching an .sla with the two paragraphs I've been attempting to add text as a subtitle in between. Details at the end.
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: utnik on April 14, 2018, 08:58:43 am
hi remadepreacher

i just opened your file in scribus 1.5.3, inserted 'Trouble In Paradise' between the two paragraphs and changed the paragraph style to 'heading 3' – there is no crash on my system (high sierra – the same as you use…)

either there's something wrong
as your file won't open in scribus 1.4.6 without conversion, i tested only with 1.5.3.

utnik
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: GarryP on April 14, 2018, 11:24:43 am
remadepreacher, please don't assume that moving to 1.5.x will let you get round problems that you find with 1.4.6.
1.4.6 has been around - unchanged - for more than two years and, as such, pretty much all of the problems have been seen before and workarounds are already known.
The 1.5.x versions are developmental software and, as such, each one has its own set of issues that have not yet been sorted.

My general advice is to use 1.4.6 until 1.6 comes out. If you use 1.5.x you lay yourself open to having all kinds of problems that no-one has seen before because the software hasn't been tested properly. If you have a problem with 1.4.6 you can usually get a quick fix, if you use 1.5.x you might have trouble getting an answer at all.

I realise that some people find that 1.5.x is stable for them but you never know when a developer will change/remove something without notice that will stop your documents from working. 1.5.x should only be used if absolutely necessary and only by people who know how 1.4.6 works.
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: remadepreacher on April 14, 2018, 10:42:01 pm
Gary, thanks for the advice about which version to use.
Utnic, I was struggling with an earlier downloading of 1.4.6 — to the point of the program shutting down with #11 crashed every time I tried to do anything with it — even a few minutes. This gives me the impression that these crashes are accumulative. So, when I downloaded anew I started over with this project. I'm sure it is wise to do that again. This could explain why it happens every time on my computer and not yours. Most of the text is in Georgia, it seems wise to delete any font of Georgia and download from a source known to be good. I may go the extra caution of choosing another font to replace it for the book.

However, I have new information. The odt that I downloaded apparently still contains some corruption from the PDF-OCR process. Some was obviously there at the time, some words simply did not look right. I thought I got rid of it, Acrobat's Preflight gave them a green light — but evidently not. I was able to try Datanumen's Word Repair (in my old PC that works only occasionally) on the odt document that produced the crash today. It says it is corrupted and unable to repair it. Why my computer is more susceptible to this corruption than yours? Probably something to do with corrupted fonts on mine (that Font Book's verification can't detect). It seems best to simply do a clean download of High Sierra and keep any previously constructed odt's and PDF's and Word docs off.

I've changed the fonts in the document and will try it again in Datanumen, if the PC comes back (it's currently back in black screen and starting up in safe mode doesn't work).
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: utnik on April 15, 2018, 10:00:01 am
as i wrote in the bug tracker, you should try to isolate the problem by testing parts of your complex workflow separately, instead of changing everything (new operating system, new font files…) at the same time.
if a car wouldn't run, your solution could be to change the battery, the inyector pump and all the ignition plugs before a real 'bug hunting attempt' would lead to an empty fuel tank…

utnik
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: remadepreacher on April 16, 2018, 03:01:01 pm
I'm still unable to work directly in a 1.4.6 text box. I turned on the function keys but F3 still opens the File Properties box as does double clicking on text. Other f keys open properties and the Story Editor but others have nothing else to do with Scribus. F3 plus fn takes it to desktop view. I'll take off 1.4.6 and download anew and see if that makes a difference.
My PC is still stuck in black screen but I tried the test of changing the font from Georgia to HK Serif in a the problem odt and the styles in Scribus. Now there is no problem with putting that subtitle in. I'll be interested in seeing if Datanumen will be able to repair the document after this change.
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: remadepreacher on April 18, 2018, 04:56:23 am
I took 1.4.6 off and downloaded it again. No change in behavior — I still cannot work directly on the text in a text box.
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: utnik on April 18, 2018, 06:41:19 am
hi remadepreacher

just replacing the scribus application is usually not the way to go.
i told you before what you should do if you suspect a problem with your installation:
…either there's something wrong
  • with your scribus installation → to check this you could close scribus, and remove the directory: /users/'your user name'/library/preferences/scribus from the library or rename it to 'scribus_old' and restart scribus.[/l][/l]
with all the strange stuff, like:
…F3 still opens the File Properties box as does double clicking on text.

i would really recommend to remove the scribus properties folder and let scribus rebuild it.
utnik[/list]
Title: Re: Trouble with "Get Text"
Post by: remadepreacher on April 18, 2018, 11:06:29 pm
Thanks, utnik, I removed Scribus preferences from two places but could not find a Scribus properties file on the mac. Do I need to look somewhere I haven't thought of or are you meaning to remove a properties file direct from the Scribus program?
After removing preferences I was able to double click on the text box one time. After that it was back to the non-working behavior.